May 29 2004

Is his Thai internet bride a con-girl? #4

Is his Thai internet bride a con-girl?

Things are getting worse for Mark, the 46 year-old American accountant who chose an 18 year-old Thai bride from AmericanSingles.com. The manipulative little cow has been shagging another guy in his apartment and now she's driving a wedge between him and his best mate. Mark's farang ex-girlfriend, Marianne, takes up the story. If you haven't done so already, you should read her first, second and third letters before continuing.

Some HUGE events have occurred since last update - all of which you predicted of course, but at the snail's pace my newly hired PI is operating, I'll be in a Nursing Home, on feeding tubes by the time any additional useful info is uncovered!

In a separate piece on this website, I indicated that Nok left Mark 2 months ago. Well, she did. She manipulated his best friend into calling her father and having him wire cash for a flight back to Bangkok. Unfortunately, for reasons only Mark knows, she returned to him 4 weeks later.

Anyway, if you're willing, please take a look at the remaining new developments, and render your opinion of what they portend:

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1) Using 6 digital photos of Nok, my new PI presented them to neighbors at the Sukhumvit Townhouse address I discovered (via Google) and this is what was learned: The condo unit is very large and is owned by Nok's Aunt. No one has seen Nok there for a long time. The unit has been unoccupied for 2-3 years; however, a maid comes to clean weekly (indicative of wealth if they don't have to rent or sell unit). Neighbours don't know anything about Nok's father, or remaining family, save for the fact they reside/have always resided in Lopburi, an historic town, as I'm sure you're aware, 2 hours north of Bangkok.

2) Using this info, my PI was able to find records for Nok stating her father's name, revealing him by title to be a doctor. Apparently, nothing about her mother or the existence of an older brother on that particular record.

3) Mark's best friend, Bill, recently revealed events leading up to Nok's departure 2 months ago. Bill is an attorney and has been like a brother to Mark since they were toddlers. Bill related that Nok had been "entertaining" a teenage guy while Mark was at work and he found out (Mark announced this fact loudly in a restaurant one night while out with Bill and Nok). Nok then told Bill she was afraid for her life, she hated Mark and wanted to return to LOS, but Mark wouldn't let her. Feeling sorry for her, Bill facilitated the escape. This damaged his friendship with Mark almost irreparably.

4) Also, Bill mentioned that from the first day Nok met him (read: the day Bill first appeared in his $70,000 new Boxter Porsche), she began to call him at his law office many times a week and tell him how Mark hits and threatens to kill her, and then asked Bill if he would help her get a divorce/allow her to live in his house until she returns to LOS! (Note: recall that Nok left me similar voicemail, during her first month stateside e.g., "he heet me near my face and bahdee" and would ask me to help her get a "d'wort whit heem" and Mark does not hit women; besides he's so big, having gained 50 lbs since Nok arrived, if he had even hit her once she would have required major hospitalization!) (This little b*tch needs to be stopped!)

5) According to Bill, prior to her departure, Nok has trashed Mark's apartment, not once, but 3 times in a manner that prompted residents living beside them, to call the Police (that's not counting the number of times she did it that the police were not called to the scene)

6) Nok has been back in U.S. for a few weeks and for the first time since she arrived last July, Mark called me at work. I was so taken aback and overwhelmed with concern for him that I proceeded foolishly to try to convince him that Nok is essentially a spoiled, lazy, violent, liar with no conscience who is working hard to find a replacement for him all day/everyday while he's at work, and no man is off-limits to her, including his best friend. Needless to say, after listening intently to what I said, he told me to never contact him for any reason and he hung up on me. (He's totally addicted and in denial still).

My questions:

1) Why would Nok have been allowed by her father, who lived in Lopburi, to go live with her Aunt at 13/14, in Bangkok, when she had just returned to him, supposedly, from living with her birth mother in Hong Kong, at age 10?

David replies: I don't think that Nok ran away to live with her aunt - she was probably sent away by her father and his new wife. In Thailand, when parents split, it's an all too common outcome.

To some degree, Thai parents regard their children as an investment. Children are expected to support their parents in later life and providing childcare is a bit like making payments into a pension plan. This tradition is deeply engrained into Thai culture but it doesn't adapt well to relationship breakdown and remarriage.

The step-parent has nothing to gain from a pay-it-forward arrangement and will often regard their partner's offspring as a liability - or even a threat. Packing them off to live with blood-relatives - usually the grandparents or an unmarried aunt - is the obvious solution (and more humane than bundling the unwanted kids into a sack and tossing them into the canal). The new couple can then start their own family together.

For Nok, it must have been quite upsetting to see both of her ex-parents playing happy families while she was being brought up by an aunt. No wonder she's screwed up.

2) Do you now think Nok may never have actually lived in Lopburi with her father, or that she ran away at an early age, like my PI thinks?

David replies: Lopburi is famous for it's monkeys and Miss Nok is a very cheeky monkey indeed. However, this doesn't prove that she ever lived there.

3) The fact that she lived with her Aunt in a nice condo in Sukhumvit, at age 14, do you feel this lends more, or less support to the possibility of her actually having an older brother with his own Condo in the same area?

David replies: I still think that "brother" is a euphemism for boyfriend/sugar daddy. However, the fact that Nok comes from a rich and propertied family is now proven beyond doubt.

4) While back in Bangkok for 1 month, she told Mark she was again living with her "brother". Why do you think she returned because when she left she acted as though she wasn't returning and didn't speak to Mark from Bangkok for 2 weeks? (Did she decide while in Bangkok that since Bill finally gave in to her manipulations and helped her escape, if she returned to Mark, perhaps she can get Bill to take her away from Mark altogether and then she would have a real rich farang at her disposal? Did her "brother"/Thai boyfriend encourage her to go back and hang out for the Green card and alimony? Did she realize Mark is the only person she knows that allows her to lie around all day and do nothing with her life and decide to return to the lazy life and continue to search for a wealthier replacement for Mark?)

David replies: Having escaped from a stressful situation in the U.S., Nok spent several weeks in Bangkok reflecting on her life. As a fairly plain and lazy girl who didn't complete her university education, the prospects of her finding a rich husband and/or of securing well-paid employment are quite bleak.

She's fucked around far too much to be taken seriously by any eligible Thai man and, unfortunately for her, all the eligible local farang men have been hunted to near extinction by stunning Thai babes - and both types of fella can spot a con-woman at 1,000 yards. Naive farangs who have never been with a Thai girl before are a rare commodity over here - which is why Nok's prospects are so much better in the U.S. Over there, she's a big fish in a small pond.

Thai women have a tendency to collect men. Mark is an important part of Nok's collection and she will use him for as long as she sees fit. For all we know, her "brother" might be just another farang in her little black book. Bill is now part of her collection too but it's not yet clear just how far she's sunk her claws into him. She will definitely offer him sex at the earliest opportunity - if she hasn't done so already. The guys that you know about are probably just the tip of Nok's promiscuous iceberg.

You speculate that a Thai boyfriend might be directing Nok's actions from Bangkok, like an evil svengali, but I'm fairly certain that this isn't the case. It's much more likely that Nok is a lone opportunist who takes whatever she can get from all the men around her. The only guy that she seems to be genuinely in love with is the Korean yuppie - and he's obviously not directing operations.

Conclusion

I'm sorry that my earlier predictions seem to be coming true. This unhappy story is unfolding like a slow-motion car-wreck before our eyes. Until a better opportunity arises, Nok will continue to turn up like a bad penny - and Mark will always take her back. No matter what she does, he's incapable of dumping her.

You must be kicking yourself for mishandling Mark's attempt to get back in touch. He was looking for a shoulder to cry on but, instead, you confronted him with the unpalatable truth. Criticising people's loved-ones is always unwise. Even if the allegations are true, to be told that "Your father is a drunk and your mother is a whore" is deeply hurtful and almost unforgivable. Mark will confide in you eventually - but only if you can resist the urge to finish his sentences for him. When he gets in touch again, I know that you will handle things better.

Unused to dealing with Thai women, Bill mishandled things too and Mark now questions his loyalty. His intensions might have been honourable but, by allowing Nok to phone him behind Mark's back, Bill made a serious error of judgement (False sob-stories are the Thai con-woman's most powerful weapon). It's tragic to see their life-long friendship being jeopardised by the actions of a devious little slut. Bill should now cut off all contact with Nok and offer Mark a sincere apology for interfering in matters that were none of his business. If Mark needs help, he will ask for it.

In a previous letter, you told me that Mark didn't have any friends. If you had mentioned Bill before, I would have warned you what to expect. Dodgy Thai wives always try to shag their husband's mates - and unfortunately they often succeed. The damage that they can do to a guy isn't limited to his finances.

According to the psychologists, Mark's recovery will follow a pattern.

Stage 1 - Denial
Stage 2 - Depression
Stage 3 - Anger
Stage 4 - Acceptance

Nok's exit probably plunged Mark into depression but, as you correctly point out, her reappearance has thrown him back into denial again. Mark has much to be angry about but he doesn't know it yet and an acceptance that Nok is just using him is still a long way off. Only when she has disappeared for good can he begin his road to recovery.

Just to put the cat amongst the pigeons, I have one more prediction for you. Thai women are truly addictive so, when Nok is finally off the scene, don't be too surprised if Mark gets on the next plane to Thailand to hunt for her replacement.

The drama unfolds...

[Posted to Your Letters by David]

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Readers' comments

TG says:

I don't want to seem unsympathetic by asking favors but
Could you supply the name of the “Good” P.I. I think it is important for the rest of us, that we do know who are the better ones to go to, even if it saves us the time (not to mention the funds) if we have to inquire about our Tilak

May 29, 2004 3:48 PM

Abrak says:

David,

I have followed this saga closely and your analysis has always been pretty well spot on. However, I do feel you are being somewhat disingenuous about Bill (yeah I know he is only a side character).

You see there is part of Marianne's story that doesnt really add up - I quote...

"She manipulated his best friend into calling her father and having him wire cash for a flight back to Bangkok."

(1) If she wanted to call her father she didnt need Bill to do it for him

(2) There is no way she would contacted her father having been excommunicated by her family. It flies against the whole 'face' issue (as you pointed out in a previous post).

(3) If Bill had contacted her Dad and he had wired the money then he certainly would not have let her fly back to the States.

It is bleeding obvious that Bill bought the ticket for Nok as the best hope of getting the scheming bitch away from his best friend. Bill is hardly going to tell that to Mark or Marianne (certainly not Marianne!!). Incidentally this explains why Nok came back to the US so quickly - there was not even a forgiving family waiting for her in BKK.

An error of judgement? I dont think so... Mark is cracking up under all this - the gaining 50lbs, not listening to friends, the loud announcement at the restaurant, the blind devoted loyalty to Nok (he was hardly the strongest character before all this started). Sometimes, as a friend, it is right to interfere. An airfare to Bkk seems a small price to pay in an attempt to get this slut's fangs out of Mark before he cracks completely.

May 29, 2004 6:03 PM

David says:

Abrak - You may be right about Bill's role but it doesn't change the fact that his actions (no matter how well meaning) actually made the situation worse. Personally, I'd be absolutely furious if a friend tried to interfere in my love-life like that. Mark's life is his own and, if he chooses to hang out with a devious little slut, then it's his call. He will come to his senses eventually - David.

May 29, 2004 6:34 PM

Stillmatic says:

go ahead and questiom my ethics, but i don't care.
as you may or may not know a lot of bar girls' email pw is 123456 or 1111111, or some bull shit like that, i shit you not!
there are two thai girls's email add i cracked. both were friends of my thai-girls. i did it for fun to see if it would work. it's provided me with a soap opera in the form of email. one account has a girl accidentally sending the wrong email to the wrong guy.
the other the guy is apologizing for yelling at her on the phone because he contracted vd from her.
what is it with this sick voyeurstic fascination in to another man's down fall? would we be as interested in mark if nok was a kind, gentle, and loving wife?
it all comes down to man's sick new fetish; Reality T.V.

May 30, 2004 1:57 PM

Marianne says:

TG:

I'll be more than happy to give you the name of my PI once the investigation is complete. As I mentioned, currently the case seems to be stalled & having experienced the same situation from my previous PI at a similar juncture, I'm not yet ready to endorse anyone until ALL contractually agreed upon deliverables have arrived.

Abrak:

Conveniently for Nok, the nite Bill said he phoned her father to request money for plane fare, was the very nite Mark had stood up & shouted out Nok's infidelity in public. Since he refused to quiet down, Bill said Mark was forcibly "removed" from the restaurant by security.

Nok then took her cue from Mark's forced removal & played up her desperation to Bill w/the skill of a Shakespearean actor. So, while poor Mark was driving home angry/depressed thinking Bill would drive Nok back to his apt. following dinner, Nok was batting her eyelashes & pleading w/Bill to take her to his house & help her fly back to Bkk, stating this would surely be the nite Mark would kill her! In fact, according to Bill, she asked him all the way to his house, "will Mark come here & kill us tonite?". Yes, Bill may have lied about calling her father, & simply purchased the ticked himself, I don't know.

But then too, perhaps Nok was never actually excommunicated from her family to begin with. I have always felt she simply gets to do as she pleases b/c her father is geographically distant for reasons that were unclear. Now that we know he has always lived 2hrs away, could it be that it only appears as though she's been excommunicated? No doubt Auntie is rich & self-involved, so Nok get's away w/murder & has since she was 13, b/c her father doesn't have a clue what she is doing, in Bkk, until way after the fact. If so, then her father may have been willing to fly her home, once she had manipulated him into believing she had learned her lesson, etc., & would never stray again.

Then, all she had to do was to stay in Bkk w/her "brother" (god knows w/whom she told her father she would be staying in Bkk, this goaround), rather than Lopburi, when she arrived in LOS a couple of mos ago. And just as she did when she flew to Nicaragua to marry Mark & then to U.S. 6 mos later, she simply broke her promises to her father, & snuck away. She must adore all of this attention from old suckers willing to throw thousands of dollars into keeping her around. What a great gig for a lazy, spoiled, sl*t, huh?!

David:

Omitting Bill's friendship was unintentional. I probably should have said that Bill is his only other friend here, but that he is so busy w/his law practice, he never has time to socialize or visit w/Mark. Unfortunately, Bill has never told Mark about Nok's incessant calls to his office, accusing Mark of battery & asking him if she could come live w/him, as he felt it would be too hurtful for Mark to know, or that Mark wouldn't have believed him anyway. I have since educated Bill in the ways of Thai con-girls, thus helping him to evaluate her past & any future behavior towards him w/a well informed perspective. Needless to say, Mark has forbidden Bill from speaking to or visiting Nok.

Once again, I completely agree that Nok was most likely shuttled off to live w/her Aunt in Bkk the minute her father remarried & goes along way in explaining why she is so emotionally/ psychologically disturbed.

Bill also commented to me how strange Nok's shape was--e.g., tall/skinny save for her upper arms & a little bulge/fat roll around her waist. Bill agrees that it appears as a vestige of pregnancy. Having lived far from her father's watchful eye, in the hands of an Aunt who clearly paid little attention to Nok's promiscuity, what are the odds that Nok has an illegitimate child somewhere? High, I would think.

What Nok didn't plan on in returning stateside, was the fact that I would be discussing her behavior w/Bill so he now knows what to expect from her & how to handle it, that access to Bill would be completely cut off, or that Mark's Landlady finally got around to confirming w/their neighbors that the Police had been called in 3 times. The Landlady has now warned Mark that if she hears as much as 1 more complaint from the neighbors that loud voices, or objects being thrown around, or the Police are called in, he & Nok will be immediately served an eviction notice.

As it stands, Nok returned stateside thinking: 1) she has seen the promise land, full of rich, handsome American men (Mark is average-looking here, 48 yrs old, poor & now morbidly obese), so why not keep digging for gold; 2) she can return to LOS anytime she wants, especially if her Daddy did buy her ticket this past trip; AND 3) Mark will certainly allow her to "do" anyone/anything she wants & still take her back whenever she asks.

What she didn't bargain for was the eviction warning from the Landlady & therefore, she now can't as much as raise her voice, or throw a pillow w/o her & hubby being thrown out on the street (Mark can only afford to move into a much worse apt, if that happens). Also, she didn't plan on me informing Mark that she had tried to put the moves on Bill. Therefore, it will be eons before Mark allows Bill to be anywhere near her & Bill doesn't want anything to do w/her, anyway, since I gave him the "411" on Thai congirls. In other words, things will be much more difficult for her, now that Mark takes nothing for granted/watches her like a hawk, keeps her away from men to the extent possible & she can't throw anymore hissy fits (her stock/trade).

For now, she is hemmed in on all sides. Everyone in Mark's apt complex is watching them, b/c the Landlady interviewed everyone in the bldgs close to their apt/then gossip spread & Bill & I are watching for her to explode. Should be interesting. I wonder which will happen first--she get's caught w/another man, in the act, or she trashes his apt again??

June 1, 2004 7:21 AM

Marianne says:

David:

I neglected to ask you if your former prediction of Nok being gone within a year still holds? If so, we have only 4 wks in counting, as she arrived stateside last year on June 30. Or did the 1 yr clock get reset when she returned from Bkk 2 mos ago?

Because this is was & is my concern regarding her finding a replacement for Pete. As I mentioned when the one yr issue first surfaced. Though now I believe she can ensnare various males for bedroom olympics--from the Pizza delivery boy, to next door neighbors, to men she hands her phone # to in the bars; however, getting one to permanently take her away from Mark will be, I would think, an entirely different matter.

American men have no problem shagging all the women they can do (esp ones like Nok who appear helpless & doe-eyed), all day/everyday, but in no way are they looking to take in a stray who is married to another man, whose Greencard hasn't even been printed. So I still cannot imagine she will have an easy time of it finding anyone but teenage boys, living near by, willing to shag her for fun. Mark will never be rid of her, if its going to take her finding a permanent replacement for him here in the states. And as you say, with her violent personality, even if she did find another sucker, no man but Mark would keep her for more than a day. Don't you agree?

If true, how long will she live in this fishbowl, with everyone watching her every move in U.S. now, with no prospects of replacing Mark, before she gives up entirely & returns to LOS, where she at least knows the language/culture & has friends her age?

June 2, 2004 2:11 AM

AGONY AUNTIE says:

Marianne, it's natural for you to feel jealous, thousands of centuries of evolution have programmed you that way. But think about it--does it really help you get what you want? You may be:

(a) signaling to Nok that you want something that she has, so that its value goes up to her and maybe she will hold on to it more tightly, and

(b) signaling to Mark that you want him bad, so that he is likely to lose interest--people want what they cant have.

A better strategy might be to get out and enjoy your own life and forget about these two. Two possible outcomes:

(a) Mark might feel left out and come after you, or (b) Mark might not come after you, but you're having so much fun you don't care.

Also: (a) you probably want to think about whether Mark is really what you want. After all, you broke up with him, presumably for good reasons, and

(b) I wouldn't agree that somebody your age cannot compete with a teenager. Look at Princess Di and Camilla!

July 23, 2004 2:22 PM

James Samui says:

Sounds to me that you have a bity of the green eyed monster and that you should realize that he does not want you and to move on with your life.

Perhaps if you worried as much about your own life as you do his then you wouldn't be this sick bitter and twisted elderly alone woman.....you fucking nutter.

Go on the Nok!!!!

August 2, 2004 7:45 PM

Anonymous says:

my husband is currently visiting his thai girlfriend and her family in buri- ran. i think that after knowing this creature for only three months,that he is finally realizing that he is being taken for a ride, by both her and her family!he is fifty years old with a loving wife and two children at home in england.she is 29 years old and can only offer him sex on demand!in every orofice possible. she is nothing but a farrange shark and he is the golden goose, who has already parted with money to buy a water purifier at the family home in the village where she lives. I really hope that he wakes up and smells the coffee before he is ripped off any more. his family are totally disgusted and appalled by his behaviour, because he is, or was, a respected bussinessman in england with an untarnished reputation untill this harlot got her claws into him in the hardrock cafe in kuala lumpur. by the way her name is fiif (surprise!surprise!) and he is called peter,you will often find them propping up the bar in the hard rock in K.L. or slumming it back in the village in buri-ran, sad pair of bastards, you could say that they deserve each other!!!!!!!!

August 1, 2006 10:01 PM

Bill (no kidding, but not the lawyer guy) says:

I would like to start by saying great story. Do I think she is a con girl? No, I actually don't. Look the guy has no money, he has had a colostomy (no frickin way thats attractive), and if the psycho white chick is to be believed he is now huge! WTF is she gonna con him out of? Also if the story is to be believed she ain't all that much to look at. So you got an ugly, fat thai chick, with a drunk old dude wearing a colostomy bag. Just who is she cheating on him with? I am 40 and wouldn't touch a fat ugly chick with a diamond shaped (fat in the hips?) body if she paid me. Think of it this way More likely she has had some boyfriends and maybe turned a trick or two but who cares? Where I grew up in the states it was nothing for a 16 year old girl to have had dozens of partners and still cheat on thier boyfriends. So, whats the big difference here? The difference is who wrote the story in the first place. Jealous ex-girlfriend (who I will bet is not hot whatsoever and probably does not teach aerobics) who is spinning the situation to justify her own messed up self worth. Hey if the thai chick sleeps around so what? The drunk old fat dude with the colostomy bag seems to like having her around even though she leaves him now and then and he is said to know she has cheated on him. From what I know of thai girls and I have known many, they are just generally on the lazy side and looking for someone to take care of them. Mark chose to take care of her she accepted. If it doesn't work out she will leave and he will go find another one. No big deal. As for the fights, think about it he is a drunk with mental problems (adhd, etc) I think the EX is blaming the issue entirely on the girl but hell a drunken guy will start fights and I might even buy off on the he smacks her around a bit. So, give it a rest he made his choices she made hers. He has nothing to lose as he is broke, fat, in poor health, a drunk, and wears a colostomy bag. Let it be and let the dude live his life as he chooses.

October 17, 2006 12:33 AM

philH says:

Like you say David just like a slow motion train wreck. I guess a lot of us have either been there at least in part or witnessed similar situations.

Right now there is a young guy in the office here in KL, recently divorced, hooked up with this Chinese girl. She is as manipulative as any of the Thai women and he is as green as the spring pasture. We have tried telling him a few home truths but he's not in listening mode. Takes her back to the UK this Xmas to meet his family.

The incredible part of Mark's story is the devotion displayed by his ex, Marianne. She truly is one in a million.

October 18, 2006 8:02 AM

Bob says:

This sounds a lot like my story (my psycho Thai ex was even called Nok as well) except that I'm only 24. David: You come across as being very wise and experienced in these matters, so I was wondering if you could help me answer a few questions.

1.Are there any support groups or internet groups for victims of Thai con-women? If so it might be worth mentioning the address to Mark and let curiosity give him a chance.

[As far as I'm aware, no such group exists - David]

2.What sort of evidence is there to back up your predictions about her behaviour? The reason why I'm asking is because I'm currently going through a divorce with my violent ex and she wants to take our son with her to Thailand even though she's never lifted a finger to look after him and I'd like to be able to show the court something that would indicate her not letting me see him if she gets custody. I know it's unlikely to have much effect but there's no harm in trying and letting the lawyer decide whether or not to use the evidence of him disappearing if she gets custody.

[My predictions about a Thai con-girl's behaviour are based on observation. I'm not qualified to offer you legal advice but, in my experience, divorce courts automatically regard the man as the guilty party unless there's damning evidence to the contrary - David]

February 2, 2007 7:47 AM

qman says:

Bob, if your son has a passport from your country you can apply for a court order to alert customs so that they can prevent him being taken out of the country without your permission.
Even if you ex has custody of your son, you still have the right to see him but you will be responsible for child support until he is 18.

February 3, 2007 8:16 AM

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