September 15 2003

Smile, you're in Thai jail

Thai jail: Not much to smile about

After a busy day sidestepping sadistic guards, bullying their fellow prisoners and taking turns to lie down in grossly overcrowded cells, many inmates of Thailand's notorious jails choose to relax with a drug fix and a satisfying bum-rape.

Last week, prison tours where laid on so that misbehaving vocational students could see for themselves just how awful the conditions are in Thai jails. On being shown the toilets, many pledged to change their ways.

The food isn't very nice either. In his book The Damage Done, Aussie ex-prisoner Warren Fellows explains that the food was so bad that many prisoners preferred to feed it to the swarming cockroaches - and then eat the cockroaches. A handful of the smelly insects ground up in a cup were the nearest thing they had to a tasty, nutritious snack.

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According to Fellows, many foreign prisoners found a release in hard drugs. These were allegedly purchased straight from the guards. How ironic that it was often minor drug offences that got them there in the first place.

For some, the ordeal proved too much and they went mad. In one of the book's most harrowing passages, intolerant guards beat a crazed westerner unconscious and dragged him by the feet down some concrete stairs. His head smashed on every step and by the time they reached the bottom his brains were spilling onto the floor.

Some of his stories illustrate the lighter side of prison life. For a few packets of cigarettes you could fuck a pig on the prison farm and for a couple of packets more you could enjoy the attentions of a female one.

Last week, the Bangkok Post reported how four inmates of Nonthaburi Jail were publicly beaten by a guard. On a drain-cleaning detail at the Public Health Ministry, the four were left to carry on while the guard enjoyed a drink with his buddies. When he returned, things were not to his satisfaction so he beat the crap out of them in full public view. Horrified Ministry staff called the police. No arrest was made but the incident was reported in the papers.

At a hastily arranged press conference the cringing prisoners were paraded before the media. A Corrections Department official said there would be an inquiry into the beating but added that the prisoners had not yet voiced any complaint. Well, fancy that.

Despite the horrors, some foreign inmates do all they can to resist serving their sentence in their home country. I began to understand the reason for this when I bumped into a British guy who was over to visit his friend in jail. Apparently, his wealthy friend had secured himself a bungalow in the prison grounds together with luxuries such as a cellphone. Similar claims were also made publicly by massage magnate turned whistle-blower Chuwit Kamolvisit.

Such refinement is only for the wealthy few so avoiding a long stretch makes good sense. In practical terms, this means walking away from trouble, avoiding drug users and checking your date's date of birth on her ID card (subtract 543 from the Thai date). Most jailed foreigners are in for drug offences. Typically, a personal use cannabis bust in Europe warrants little more than a slap on the wrist. Not so in Thailand.

The Government is fighting a drug problem far worse than anything yet seen in the west. The country is awash with pills; most of them smuggled in from Burma to finance various guerrilla armies. Desperate times have led to desperate measures. Suspected drug dealers are routinely shot. Some estimates put the death toll at around 3,000 but, in the wake of international criticism, official figures are no longer published.

Some complacent ex-pats reckon that the going rate for buying yourself out of a small dope bust is about B15,000. They may well be right but what happens if the arresting officer is honest or, more plausibly, just doesn't like farangs? Perhaps his favourite mistress has just run off with a rich American. Let's face it, you are toast.

Useful phrases

You are my bitch
G? o pen tua mia kh?èrng chan

That pig sure has a real pretty mouth
M?èo t?™e n?¢n mee p? ak s??ay n?¢ir n?¢ir leree

Visit prisoners

You can visit foreign prisoners and bring them small gifts. Find out more at:

www.khaosanroad.com/bangedup.htm

[Posted to Thai Secrets by David]

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Readers' comments

mr peter says:

As most of the foriegn inmates are in the slammer for drugs why would anyone want to visit them? Assuming they are not half wits they knew the risks, broke thai law and are paying a considerable price. I just do not consider these people as worthy of compassion, nor do they merit a stop on the must see list of packpacker tourist stops. If you have time and compassion to spare there are lots more deserving cases, how about the AIDS wat in Lopburi or an orphange? If you must visit a prison why not visit a thai prisoner instead? -peter

February 20, 2004 7:37 PM

rolf says:

i get in some trouble there over my visa so they sent me to some place called idc in bangkok. there was a lieutenant i think his name was sura something he was the ultimate gestapo. he stole from everyone and beat them regularly. that guy should have been in prison behind the bars not enforcing his sadistic version of the law and showing off for all to see. i spent nine months there waiting deportation. be careful all i done was overstay my visa but it was many months until i was sent back home to europe. and i paid daily for things that would be free in a european prison. food that a dog would not eat. usuaully rotten rice and some yellow curry with nothing but bones in it.
i can never go back to thailand i don¥t care. i understand that¥s illegal too but they do it to everyone.
they should re organize their legal system in regard to tourists at once. it is not fair and do we do such like to their citizens here who are in some trouble? and it is very corrupt. if a tourist gets in some trouble there i ask is that a reason for all the legal authorities big and small to steal his money and make him pay bribes. so that is the biggest problem. if they want to show so that they are not a bannana replublic they better change some things fast. one day the whole thing will be exposed more on tv if it continues to go on.

February 22, 2004 5:13 PM

cochon says:

Rolf, when you visit any country in the world you must abide by their laws and customs, not your own percieved view of what is lawful and what is not. Yes it it awful when those in authority abuse their positions but unlike Europe at least it is in open, you must have known the score.

Break the law, accept your punisment no matter how harsh.

If you must break the law I suggest you do so in the UK where the criminal is the king and the victim the criminal!!!

February 26, 2004 5:09 PM

scott says:

gow pben meeya noi kong chan - does not mean you are my bitch it means you are my second wife

February 27, 2004 10:23 AM

Carl says:

The guy Fellows was Australian, please amend your article as it makes you look like you havent read the book.

Regards

[Thanks for pointing it out, Carl. I've made the change - David]

March 25, 2004 11:03 PM

Roger F says:

I love Thai Land and all the LADY BOYS. They are so pretty and satisfy my every need.....

April 27, 2004 7:56 PM

Brian says:

Mr. Peter and Cochon-Both of you would make dictators or police man! You both sound like all the B.S. propoganda we here in the states "If u cant do the time, dont do the crime" Gimme a fckn break. How can you go heartless over some poor chap who saves up for 3 years to come to Bangkok, decides he wants to smoke the whacky tobaccy one night and gets busted. He then finds himself getting ass-raped in a Thai prison for several years. Not to mention beaten and nearly starved to death. Sure you need to be aware of what the penalties are but in so many Drug related cases in Thailand, the punishment dont fit the crime. I think you can murder someone and serve less jail time. Its not like I am going to rush to the first prison and make donations, but I feel for some of them. Now I will say, if a chap is busted hauling 2 tons of marijuana, cocaine, yaba or whaterver.. then I say let him rot in jail.

May 4, 2004 10:00 PM

jas says:

any one taking or buying drugs knows the law in thailand tuff shit if you can not bribe a copper ha ha ha ha ha suckers

May 22, 2004 1:57 PM

dexlowe says:

Where is the line drawn between compassion and cynicism? I don't know. No point in asking me because we all have our own opinions, and like East and West, never the twain shall meet. I read the Warren Fellows book, but nothing he said surprised me. I've been here too long. But this anecdote might interest some:

Many years ago, my good friend J had a birthday party in his room in a Ngam Duphli guesthouse. One 'guest' smoked a joint and left a teensy bit of a roach behind the TV set. Six months later, and the immigration police do a sweep of Ngam Duphli, and they check out J's room and find this microscopic bit of dope. They hauled poor old J's ass down to Tung Mahamek police station -- I mean, J is a perfectly straight up and down guy, and he gets hauled into this fucking Suan Phlu hell hole for a roach so small, it would fit on a pin head (I know, I saw it). Well, this was a Friday, and I didn't find out about it until I got home from work. In those days, ATMs were few and far between, and I couldn't raise the 40k needed to get J out of Tung Mahamek (and we couldn't get through to his folks in Holland -- not that they could do anything). All we (myself and a couple of others) could do was bring supplies and enough money so that he could pay off the cell mafia and stay in the "foreigners' section" away from the general riff-raff (it was just an open cell area with bars, not a separate room). Now bear in mind here that men and women are lumped in together in Tung Mahamek. On Saturday, we went down a couple of times with supplies, and then back again on Sunday morning. J came out with tears streaming down his face and he was begging us to get the money so he could be bailed out. Man, it was pathetic. My heart was in tatters. He told us that during the night, women were being openly raped right next to the barred-off "cell". Right next to him. The poor bugger's nerves were shot. Well, Monday came and we were down there first thing in the morning with the money to get him out. He was a shattered man and trembling and clung to me like a man possessed. To cut a long story short, J experienced a little bit of hell through no fault of his own. It's a sobering story and one that I'm sure many foreigners have been through.

So, do I say "tuff shit"? After J's experience, no. As for those others who "deserve what they get" -- you pays your money, you takes your chances. But it doesn't seem human to me to turn your back on everyone of them. Especially when you can't be sure they aren't guilty, like J. And even the guilty ones deserve a bit of compassion when they're stuck in a Thai hell hole. Even the likes of Warren Fellows or Paul Hayward, or Lorraine Cohen.

Dex.

June 2, 2004 2:42 AM

JR says:

Prison is prison, kinda why you don't want to be in one. Ideally the conditions are fine. Criminals are criminals. IF everyone sent there was truly guilty.

That is a different issue. But the message is the same. dont fuck up, and dont even LOOK like you fucked up.

murdering some one out of passion is less as bad as a calculated atttempt to fleece the victims and deliver unto them and their family a life of suffering. Which is what drug dealers do.

We arent so blind to have forgotten how England used opium to take over China.

June 3, 2004 9:21 AM

tom says:

Fascists think it is ok to put people in jail for small mistakes. "Break the law and pay the price" - ha ha. Prostitution is illegal in Thailand. Would it be all right to put every tourist who paid for sex in jail?
Hardly.
Compassion is obviously something people have more or less off.
Excellent post by Dexlowe.
I wish the worst possible punishment on people like Mr Peter and Cochon - to be what they are.

June 5, 2004 9:28 PM

mr peter says:

So you want to let drug runners off the hook and any other idiot who thinks they have a right to ignore thai law and on the other hand wish punishment on others who have not broken any law. Compassion is something people have more or less of, it's very often mis directed on the undeserving and in your case you seem to have none at all as you wish evil on the innocent.
Bleeding heart do gooders like you make me puke, compassion should be for those that deserve it. Idiots who get busted in LOS for drugs or visa offences who think they are above the law do not- but hey many poor thais do so if you have some compassion send it thier way. How come nobody seems to give a toss about all the thai prisoners? As for 'poor J' what was the wanker doing in Los if he could not even raise 40,000 baht? hardly a fortune to keep out of jail and an amount that anybody with an ounce of sense should have been able to raise, he should have had better 'mates' if he could'nt raise that much-mr visa for example. Of course a lot is down to attitude in LOS he could almost certainly have bargained this down, but he probably told them to fuck off-peter

June 5, 2004 10:17 PM

Trong Com says:

Tom, the ability to empathize with the suffering of your fellow man is a positive character trait, not found in everyone. Be glad you were blessed with it. To wish the worst possible punishment on anyone is incompatible with empathy. It is antipathy.

People like Mr Peter and Cochon need your empathy because they are already suffering the worst possible punishment: lifetime confinement to the lonely dungeons of their own minds.

June 5, 2004 11:21 PM

TANAI KWAI says:

Tom wrote:

"I wish the worst possible punishment on people like Mr Peter and Cochon - to be what they are."

Mr. Peter curiously retorts:

"Compassion is something people have more or less of, it's very often mis directed on the undeserving and in your case you seem to have none at all as you wish evil on the innocent."

Curious because (a) Mr. Peter regards Tom's definition of punishment as every bit as bad as Tom does; and (b) because Mr. Peter has declared himself "innocent."

Tom wrote:

"Fascists think it is ok to put people in jail for small mistakes. "Break the law and pay the price" - ha ha. Prostitution is illegal in Thailand. Would it be all right to put every tourist who paid for sex in jail?"

Uncomfortable with Tom's analogy to prostitution, Mr. Peter then cleverly shifts the target back to drugs and introduces a new scourge -- "visa offences" to futher dilute Tom's point:

"Bleeding heart do gooders like you make me puke, compassion should be for those that deserve it. Idiots who get busted in LOS for drugs or visa offences who think they are above the law do not"

But Mr. Peter wrote only yesterday:

"Mostly though these days I am bored with P4P and I have to admit to going for the beautiful music..."

How nice. Now that you have sated your appetite for illegal activity everyone else should be thrown in jail for minor infractions of Thai law.

Convenient, ain't it?

(please surrender your rhetorician's license at the door)

June 5, 2004 11:46 PM

Tracey_Emmin says:

Mr Peter is a contrarian. Consistency isn't important when your aim in life is to troll thai related messageboards.

Maybe this is what too much morlam music does.

June 6, 2004 12:19 AM

NJW says:

Dear Tanai Kwai,

As you come to read Peter's posts more and more, you will see that he very often contradicts himself in his efforts to appear to be in agreement with whatever seems fashionable at the moment.

However, I find myself in general agreement with him on the fate of drug pushers. Having had personal experience of the effects of these substances, and the pressure that pushers put on their victims, I can only say that when caught they deserve to be locked up for a very long time.

You may say that I should be showing compassion on the poor souls, but no-one showed compassion when these bastards first hooked my daughter, no-one showed compassion when she died.

Compassion for the victims is not cool, better to show compassion for the idiots who trade in and smuggle drugs, and then bleat about their "human rights" when caught.

My only regret is that these people are only lowly mules, and the people who make the really big bucks are seldom caught.

Tom, you may call me a fascist if you wish, but I wonder how you would feel if some cunt had stood outside your 15 year old daughters school, tempted her with the words "Go on, it won't hurt you." Got her hooked, and then tried to put her on the game to pay for more.

Being seperated from her mother, I knew nothing of this until it was too late. Her mother tried, God how she tried, but it was all too late. Now my darling girl is dead.

Call me a fascist if you like, but if I ever find the cunts responsible, then they would consider a Thai jail to be a tea party compared to what I would do to them.

June 6, 2004 12:35 AM

Dexlowe says:

The incident with my friend "J" occurred 15 years ago when ATMs were scarce and unreliable and we were only earning about 12-15,000 baht a month. So it wasn't that easy to scrape together 40k. But then if my name was Mr Peter, I probably wouldn't have even bothered -- I wouldn't have bothered on Monday to go to the bank and draw out the money to help a friend. I would have left him there to rot. But then I'm not Mr Peter, thank f...k. Don't understand what your purpose is on this earth, Peter. Like you, I don't have much sympathy for people who commit egregious crimes, and I can be every bit as hard on them as you. But unlike you, I have a sense of fair play, which should not be interpreted as being soft. By showing compassion, I am not excusing them for their crimes, nor seeking to help them escape due process of law. (There are some hopeless cases, like the pathetic Lorraine Cohen and her son Aaron, but what the hell can you do about these people?) They don't need to be reminded of how unworthy they are, they feel it down deep into their bones every minute of every day. I don't waste my compassion on them because I feel sorry for them. Bugger that. I just don't believe there's any value in being completely cold hearted -- some souls can be saved (I'm an atheist, so don't take that as a religious comment).

Anyway, in the final analysis, I'm just glad I don't have friends like Peter. If I did, I might be inclined to shoot the bastards because they're of little value to this world. I'll continue to donate to orphanages, pay school fees for poor rural kids, help Thai kids with their English for free, make the occasional prison visit when time permits . . . whatever and however I can help within my means. And when I retire and have no personal obligations, I'll step up those activities. Care to join me, Peter, or will you still be stewing in righteous indignation?

Dex.

June 6, 2004 1:03 AM

mr peter says:

'Anyway, in the final analysis, I'm just glad I don't have friends like Peter. If I did, I might be inclined to shoot the bastards'

Oh dear isnt that rather fascist of you wanting to shoot those you don't agree with? Typical hypocrisy of the dozy left wing compassionate do gooder I guess.
On your sob story about poor lickle J I don't think you said it was 15 years ago, even more reason to have bargained the 40,000 down. I think we did have visa cards and parents to bail out the unfortunate even way back then.
I don't have to join you as I have been supporting kids in thai schools through plan international for years as well as buying equipment for a school in udon. If I might be allowed a little boast I was invited to the house of Lords last April in connection with this.
Support the less fortunate, but fuck the spoilt, selfish, greedy and stupid western scumbags in Thai jails-peter

June 6, 2004 1:19 AM

Dexlowe says:

Supporting kids and invited to the House of Lords? And you're still a prick? Shameless. And as for "fascist" -- glass houses, my stupid friend. (You're so dumb you don't even understand when someone is speaking metaphorically.) And does it matter whether I was speaking 15 years ago. Is that so relevant? Has your righteous indignation made you blind? Are you such a nitpicker? For someone who has supposedly been invited to the "House of Lords" (which is full of compassionate do-gooders), you seem to have a schizophrenic attitude.

You have very selective compassion on your part, it seems.

Maybe your "friends" in the House of Lords might be interested in your posts on this board.

June 6, 2004 3:44 AM

mr peter says:

'You're so dumb'

Is this another metaphor? ooh you are so clever, any moron can start to post personal insults (prick stupid, dumb) This sort of attitiude just shows how short you are on grey matter and arguments. At least I am not dumb enough to forget to add my name to posts ha ha. Don't have any friends in the Lords as I never went in the end. Sad that you now think it's shameless to support kids, are you sure it's me that's- schitzo?-peter

June 6, 2004 4:14 AM

TANAI KWAI says:

Tracey E. writes:

"Mr Peter is a contrarian."

I'm not much of a wordsmith. Does "contrarian" mean hateful jackass? If so, we're probably both contrarians.

NJW,

Though this is hardly the most decorous place to express it, I am truly sorry for your loss. I understand how this tragedy might inform some of the views you've expressed with which I've vehemently disagreed in the past.

For my part, I never actually stated a position except to suggest that there be some relationship between a given "crime" and its punishment. I am thus in favor of long sentences for true "drug pushers" but I cannot support gratuitous barbarism against them (as distinguished from providing them with Spartan food and quarters, which I would favor). I can understand, however, that you desire retribution, and I can't argue with your feelings.

Mr. Peter gracefully bodyslams Dex with this potent counter-move:

"This sort of attitiude just shows how short you are on grey matter and arguments. At least I am not dumb enough to forget to add my name to posts ha ha."

Ouch! Did everybody see what M.P. did there? Makes it look easy, doesn't he? Dex, I expect you'll need a little time off to recuperate ha ha. It'll be the last time you come around here with your compelling arguments and inescapable logic ha ha.

Mr. Peter, feel free to continue glossing over any points that don't suit your purposes.

(winky)

June 6, 2004 5:55 AM

John U says:

A moving and sad post by NJW 6 June at 12.35 a.m.

A compelling argument for the legalisation of all drugs.

June 6, 2004 2:08 PM

Greg says:

One thing to consider when discussing social policy is the social impact of that policy. Advocating retribution for anti-social acts can, counter intuitively, lead to greater social damage than the original crime.

Jails tend to make de-habilitate people and make them less socially valuable. Putting mothers and fathers into jail also causes social problems. For victimless offenses, one must surely choose a rational big picture approach, and lay aside the greed for veangance.

In case you think it is relevant, I am merely alcoholic and do not condone even my own drug of choice.

Rules and roles of social individuals are fine, but we must also 1) value the need for limits to big brother and 2) rationally weigh the benefit versus costs of social policies and do scientific studies to test the effects of social policies. One simply can not solely rely on a legal system to enforce social ideals.

June 6, 2004 2:24 PM

mr peter says:

from NJW 28th May saying goodbye to the board (just noticed it as I was reading post after his)

'Enjoy yourselves, children, I'm sure you wont miss me, and I certainly wont miss you.'

Then from 6th June:

'As you come to read Peter's posts more and more, you will see that he very often contradicts himself'

Looks like the pot calling the kettle black, first he leaves us all then he's back again. Will he make as many retirements as Frank Sinatra? He's right about two things drug dealers are evil bastards who ought to be shot, and no we will not be missing him-peter

June 6, 2004 5:13 PM

charlie says:

Interesting conversation. I have to say as an outsider who has just read this whole conversation I am somewhat disappointed to hear fellow humans throwing so much hate around.

Firstly anyone who deals in drugs in Thailand is an idiots and dserves to get the punishment laid out in Thai law. Secondly, one can not compate a joint butt to dealing drugs. There is an obvious difference and should be in the punishment. having said that this is not our countrya nd that is the law. so anyone smoking dope here is to say the least stupid.

As for sympathy and compassion. As human beings we should always have the capacity for compassion and symapthy. If not, then we might as well give upliving. Having said that, having sympathy and compassion does not mean i think people who deal drugs should be given freedom or not serve their sentence. They should serve it and take the responsibility as human beings for their actions. tough as it may seem.

None of this of course excuses Thai officials acting like thugs and being cruel or inhuman. That is dispicable and they should be locked up too.

Yet of course having said all that, as a none drug user, i have to say I always find the drug issue rediculous. 50% of all hospital beds in the Uk are now taken up by alcohol related probelsm. Alcohol is the surge of modern socity and aks any Doctor or Policemn to say otherwise. But most of drinka dn we defend the very governments that tax us on it, knowing what it does and the damage it causes.

Is that any different froma drug dealer.....of course not. They are making money out of a well known and highly addictive drug that makes the drug issue which infact of course it is a part of, look tiny if you seperate the two.

So....all in all.......interesting. I wish they would just throw most of the leaders of the modern world into prison with the other drug dealers and let them all rot in hell. They are all making money out of corruption, drug peddling and human misery.

Stay away from drugs ! Don't come to Thailand with out adequate funds in case of emergency ! Don't ignore Thai laws as if back in the soft cushion of European liberalism and except this ain't back home. But do have sympathy and compassion as they are admirable traits and accept responsibility for your own actions.

June 6, 2004 8:30 PM

Charlie says:

Sorry about the spelling mistakes......tired.

June 6, 2004 8:32 PM

Greg says:

Much of the focus on the drug penalties is about whether the law breaker deserves or does not deserve punishment. I suggest that this issue is minor when compared to the overall effects on the public that must pay for the incarceration. Is the public served for its benefit, or is the public merely made to feel as if right has triumphed over wrong, order has been restored, etc. If I lie and cheat someone dear, I may deserve to rot for 10 years in jail, but does the public deserve to spend $40,000 per year to house me there, and does it deserve the less employable more criminally minded person I will be on my exit from jail?

Maybe someone who smokes a joint for relaxation does not deserve punishment - maybe he does. But do you deserve to be punished in tax dollars and increased crime by criminalizing his act?

June 6, 2004 10:22 PM

Donovan says:

Shut up Peter, your rhetoric is tiresome and your writing style makes my testicles retreat into my abdomen.

-Peter' Superior

June 13, 2004 5:48 PM

Rob says:

I'm reading the book now (The Damage Done). It would appear that it is not wise to indulge in illegal activities in Thailand. I hope more people will read the book and watch movies such as the cheesy yet effective "Broke Down Palace." I can't say I understand the personal quarrels on this site, but I was happy to have found it anyway.
Rob

June 20, 2004 1:33 AM

tonychang says:

heard that "tommy top up" may have been co-author on "the damage done"

June 20, 2004 2:25 AM

Jules says:

If you get busted in Thailand for anything serious God help you.

Not all Thai police are bribable and certainly not for all crimes. I have even met honest policemen!!

But if it is a small matter and he seems serious then bribe quickly. When it gets up the ladder and more officials are involved it can become quite xpensive!!!!

Alternatively be a man and take the punishment (Not likely)

June 23, 2004 7:22 PM

Kip says:

I have all my rights by staying in the U.S. I'm fine, thanks.
Kip
U.S. National Traveler
International Scaredicat

June 26, 2004 10:56 AM

alan says:

Most of you talk about the frag's caught with a little dope and get a lot of timein. Jail when a thai in 2001 killed a frag by beating him to death. Over the thai ex girl friend dating him. Only got 7 year's in jail and smiled at the guy's parent's in court. If you won't read more on this it is posted on stick man's site.........THINK ABOUT THAT

June 30, 2004 8:58 AM

Jules says:

It is not just farangs who get banged up long time for drugs, so do Thais. It is a very serious crime here and anyone who "just has a bit" as no hope of escaping jail.

As to murder, well this can vary in Thailand.

Unfortunately no pardon on the King's birthday for drugs, terrorism or murder.

June 30, 2004 6:43 PM

keda says:

One thing I wouldn't do is visit somebody I do not know in Bang Kwang, if it means handing my passport over.

Sure, identification is probably part of the visiting process in any prison worldwide, and of course I'd get my passport back, though no doubt after my presence there has been appropriately noted, which may (or may not) return to haunt me some later time.

keda

July 20, 2004 10:50 PM

mr peter says:

There is a treat in store tonight on BBC two from 9 o clock, the documentary called the real world-the bangkok hilton is on. Looking at he previews the place did not look so bad, but I expect it gets a bit draining if you have a 40 year sentance. Seems you are likely to end up dying of TB or AIDS so the lengthy times might not be so much of a worry in the end. A must see for cocky backpakers who think they can do what they like, where they like and screw the police.-peter

July 22, 2004 7:59 PM

mr peter says:

Well this was a revelation, prison TV station BKP, ladyboys in block 4 making up and reading fashion mags, thai music videos shown in the cells (I might start trafficking) nervous understaffed prison staff, and hardly any people executed (300) and model giant giraffes to 'liven up the place'.The place came out of it very well, so well it makes you wonder if the thais had any editorial control. The only falangs shown were the many nigerians, mostly in solitary confinement and two brits. Daft as a brush michael who tried to smuggle in £50,000 of ecstacy to 'fund my holiday' and Hawke a bloke who bears an uncanny likeness to a younger mekong kurt, an old hand of over 5 years he bemoaned the fact that yanks and other europeans got out a lot earlier than brits to serve the rest (half) of the sentence at home. Well you should have thought of that before smuggling H you evil twat. You had to feel a bit sorry for the manacled michael who has a sentence of 99 years. I did not realise the prison had become quite such a tourist stop, something to be discouraged I feel as there are far more deserving of a visit. If you have time, compassion and money to spare visit those who are suffering through no fault of their own.-peter

July 23, 2004 4:02 AM

Geezah says:

If you got connections or cash you can make it all go away. With cash it's best if you are in a group to pool resources and make more of a hassle to arrest everyone. I was at a house party that was raided because the apt owner was having long running row with his neighbor and the stereo was blasting. Cops just walked in (lock you doors!) and would not let anyone leave. All supicious substance got dumped on the floor which they eventually found -- though no one knew where that came from. Good to have some Thais to help the negotiations. Eventually we all had to have our I.D.s copied by hand (though a business card worked for one bloke) and paid B45,000. And in the end one Thai had to volunteer to go the station to pay the fine for the "noise disturbance". No one was eager to step forward for that mission! The whole think took about 4 hours -- Thais were shitting themselves, farangs annoyed, cops amused. If the same happened in the UK or States the cops tell "ya ta shut up the stereo", but would never come in and frisk/search all and sundry.

Or have connections. PTT son of rather senior (senior, senior) politco was a well know yaa baa user in Uni and was getting annoyed at having to give it away all the time so started dealing. Then various parental discoveries of his other usage (e) is linked to the major farang bar p-testing sessions. (Of course if he was out and about during such a raid the cops escort him out the back.) Oh, and did a rehab stint in LA (for H.) Life ain't fair!

July 24, 2004 8:26 PM

wilbur says:

A friend of mine got chucked in jail in Thailand for immigration violations. He was doing the "mail-order visa" thing until they shut that down, then he just stopped getting visas at all, for fear of not getting back into Thailand once over a border.

The Thai cops showed up at his house unannounced. Nobody knows how they knew where to find him, a quiet Thai-fluent farang living in a nondescript row-house on an ethnically-mixed cul-de-sac neighborhood. Hauled him away out from under the noses of his (Thai) wife and daughters, and chucked him in a Chonburi jail.

No farangs can get in to see him except embassy personnel who I guess check on things periodically. Even his wife had to hire a lawyer to get her in to see him. She's allowed to bring him Care packages of food. Poor guy doesn't eat much Thai food, and that doesn't leave him shitpiles of options in those accomodations.

She is not reporting that he is being maltreated, or that there are any sorts of atrocities going on in his vicinity. You never know, though, maybe he just can't get word out for fear of having his treatment deteriorate. While the Thai immigration folks hate people like him (especially during these days of the Toxin Tyranny), his infraction is far less serious than drug trafficking or murder, so maybe they're going easy on him.

I hear tell he's getting out soon. Assuming they don't yank him from his cell and put him on the next plane out (the scenario I envision), I'll debrief him and post again. I'm guessing I'm not going to hear about Shangri-La.

July 25, 2004 1:51 AM

J D says:

I spent a weekend in the immigration jail, thanks to a cheating, lying girlfriend, who turned me in (I was very, very foolish in confiding in her that my visa had expired) after I caught her with another guy and threw her out...

Had it been a Monday, I would no doubt have been out on Tuesday, but this was Friday evening...such was my luck at the time. Imagine, being arrested on Sukhumvit Soi 22 and taken to Tonglor police station handcuffed to a Tuk-tuk that I had to pay for!

Actually turned out to be one of those experiences in life that while you wish had never happened, and certainly don't want to go through again, it wasn't THAT bad. But only because I was held in a cell that had decent people in it, also in due to visa problems. Also due to the fact that I knew I would be released as soon as the fine was paid and I had a plane ticket out of Thailand.

After being "deported", I was back in Thailand in less than four days, after having secured a proper visa in Singapore, and was warmly welcomed back so I could spend more money there. I also visited the prison again and brought food and supplies to the cell mates who made my brief stay there tolerable.

The arresting policemen, who would have let me go for a small donation to the police charity fund but couldn't due to the girl's threats to tell her influential father, also came by to see if I was okay and would always wave to me as they rode by on their motorbike.

Glad it was not more serious, and glad it was not a regular Thai jail....that would not have been an "interesting" experience for sure.

JD

August 5, 2004 1:57 PM

spirit_of_town_hall says:

JD,

Glad to hear that you were OK. Out of interest where were you caught, in your apartment? or out on the street...

Not that it was at the time, amusing being handcuffed to tuk tuk.

STH

August 5, 2004 10:21 PM

YABS says:

I totally do not agree with people being busted for smoking a bit of dope. It is ridiculous in the extreme
when you can buy valium and anabolic steroids
over the counter.
As someone has pointed out prostitution is illegal but i'm sure the likes of Mr peter etc indulge in this.
I have no compassion for smugglers/dealers or users of hard drugs. Also dtaining someone for overstayinmg their visa is uettr crap.
Most guide books just sya you can pay an ovrerstay fee at the airport which i have done.
if it sillegal then how come i didn't get arrested then! Its just an excuse by the police to get extra money.
Thailnmd wants to become a world player so it had better sort its corrupt act out!
Although i do agree that the prisons should be horrible. thats the idea of prisons to be a deterrent.
the west could learn form this. But the punishment should fit the crime.
how smoking a joint is a crime is beyond belief.
If the americans hadn't started their war on drugs i doubt any of this bullshit would exist

August 6, 2004 12:32 PM

mr peter says:

No you are wrong I never was a prostitiute in LOS, not so far anyway. As for valium it is very difficult now to get over the counter and people get busted and thrown in jail for steriods. So don't feel too persecuted if you get arrested for smoking dope (not callled that for nothing)-peter

August 6, 2004 1:31 PM

YABS says:

don't try and be clever Peter
involved in prostitution means being the customer as well.
Thats like saying only drug dealers are involved
in drug use.
dopey it may make you but i'm sure everyone will agree that its better for you than mekong.
Valium is still openly sold in chemists as are
steroids.

August 6, 2004 3:41 PM

mr peter says:

I'd like the name of the chemists then, I could not get any last time nor even halcyon, tylonol with codiene and now I hear even generic viagra is hard to come by, what's the world coming to. I cannot agree that mekong is worse for you than dope as it does not lead you to being arrested for just drinking it. Dope has far more tar in it than fags and can definately fuck your health up a lot worse. All the people of my age that I knew now dead of things like strokes, head tumors and cancer at an unusually early age were all heavy dope smokers.
The point of this argument is if you live in aonther country it's only sensible to obey the laws as much as possible agree with them or not. You can ignore the ones who people are never, or rarely done for though if you don't agree with them ie prostitiution, but if they start to arrest the punters for that it would be time to think again-peter

August 6, 2004 3:58 PM

YABS says:

I ahve yet to see any evidence that dope does you any harm other than usual smoke related stuff
if you smoke it ie thssame as cigarestes.
I know of noone who as od'd on dope.
I'm sure there are plenty of heart attack victims of
mekong though!

August 6, 2004 5:34 PM

mr peter says:

Well maybe you are a bit young yet (late 20's?) to have noticed your smoking buddies croaking it when they hit middle age. It definately has some psychotic effects as well, although it's true lethal overdoses are next to impossible. Sure mekong will do you in if you hit it hard enough but at least you won't be forever looking over your shoulder worrying about mr plod-peter

August 6, 2004 5:57 PM

JD says:

S T H...I lived in an apt. over a great bar/restaurant, and when the cashier told me the bitch had called the police about my passport/visa, I bolted over to Soi 18, but they caught up to me on their motorbike, took me back to the apartment where we vainly attempted to accept the police fund donation, but the bitch had followed us every step of the way, admonishing the poor chaps that they had better make good and take me to the Tonglor police station. Then is was to the Thai version of the Paddy Wagon, the Tuk-tuk!

Yeah, at the time, I was not amused, but looking back it makes a great story to those back home!

August 7, 2004 11:58 AM

J Silver says:

A message to all foreigners. Before you visit a foreign country, be sure that you comply with all customs and laws. I have seen many foreigners who found themselves in trouble because of girl friends. It is common that a foreigner will loose all of his money in trying to help or establish a business for his girlfriend's family. As a result, the foreigner finds that his does not have enough money to extend his visa. Thinking that his family in the States or Europe will bail him out, he discovers that his family and friends do not have the money to send him. The foreigner finds himself at the mercy of immigration officials. thus learning that his life has become a nightmare.

My point: (1) makes sure that you have large amount of money for emergencies - many foreigners do not have adequate money funds when they arrive in Thailand or Philippines.

(2) be mindful of your behavior about laws and customs.

(3) trust no one - not everyone is your friend.

I am aware that the above 3 comments sound inane, but many foreigners find themselves in trouble because they do not use thier common sense.
Sincerely Joe

August 11, 2004 2:38 AM

dtoodman says:

I believe that you get 10 straight years for possession of even a tiny bit of ganga with the current drug war going on. Steer clear of anything not sold in pharmacies. Thailand is where you want to go to dry out these days, not get high. Stick with Carlsbergs and over the counter stuff. A two hour full body traditional Thai massage will set you straight. The strong Thai weed will make you disoriented and impair your judgement. This ain't the 70's. If you meet girls that are power drinking and hyper they are probably doing the Meth. Avoid them and avoid being involved in any shape or form in any kind of drug transaction, even giving some slapper money for her goods. That can backfire really bad because if she gets popped she is going to bring the little guy in brown right to you and your deep pockets. Even hooking up somebody with VOIP on their computer so she can call for free can land you in jail for a long time. The simple pleasures there should be ample.

September 24, 2004 8:26 AM

ozricdan says:

drugs kill.....kill the drug dealers.

ROLF.. do you know why it took so long did you not have anyone working for you in your country from the embassy.

i know some countries wont do much to help but surely if you've only overstayed your visa then you should not have to stay so long.

i overstayed my visa was in jail for only 9 days and was deported but i was still able to return.

August 16, 2006 9:38 PM

El guapo says:

contrary to everything I have read on this site, you'll be surprised to hear male rape is generally frowned on in thai prisons... hence the pig farms.
I heard from a Thai vet that in certain buddhist temples are overcrowed with stray dogs who have suspicious walking gaits... the monks are forbidden to have ANY contact with female flesh but the dalai lama preached that humans are effectively no different to canines... draw your own conclusions

November 30, 2006 4:39 PM

dave says:

spent 5 yrs in thai jail after setup by your friendly neighbour thai police.i now take great pleasure in insulting every thai i meet who says thailand is a great place.gutless lieing race of people,rather eat my own shit then go back there.

December 1, 2006 5:08 PM

WARICK HUNT says:

WOULD BE INTRESTED TO KNOW HOW DAVE DEC 1ST WAS SET UP AS ANY INFORMATION REGARDING SCAMS,SET UPS ECT WILL I AM SURE BE USFUL

December 3, 2006 2:09 PM

Ryan says:

Buying drugs in Thailand fuels guerilla wars in neighbouring countries. Anyone who finances these people are contributing to mass murders. Sounds like these tourists are right where they belong. They should be happy they're not getting the death sentance like in many other countries in south east asia.

December 8, 2006 1:18 AM

Stoned and feeling good says:

Ryan:
Yeah sure... tourists that buy a couple of pills or a bag of weed in Thailand, really contribute to mass murders. Whatever man, why don't you pull your head out of your ass? It attitudes of people like you that make this world a shitty place to live in...

December 8, 2006 5:38 AM

Johnny Tokyo says:

Ryan

Sensible thinking from a fine lad with a super-splendid head on his shoulders.
Care to meet for a quick drink and a chat? I promise you son, this won't take very long :-)

JT

December 8, 2006 12:36 PM

Road Natzi says:

I have been going to Thailand for approximately 20 years, mainly due to the fact my father lived there for a long time. I travel there regularly, anywhere up to 3 or 4 times every year. This year (2006) I spent four and a half months in Thailand.
.
In all my visits in all my time, I HAVE NEVER BEEN ARRESTED NOR SEEN THE INSIDE OF A JAIL CELL. The closest I got to that was paying a 'Helmet' fine in Phuket. You might think that I don't get out and about but, you wrong, I've been there and done that, I'm getting to know that place.
.
Anyway, most of the stories are pathetic and I reakon those of you who ended up in Jail enjoy becomming the 'farang pig on the spit'. Its a pity that the laws in half the European countries are not a little tougher, because if they were, that might mean some of the 'filth' that is navigating its way around the globe might be locked up in their own countries in stead of clogging up all the thai cells. I applaud the thais for locking scum bags up....goodness knows thats my favourite past time.
.
If you want to sit around wingeing about 'poor little billy the drug fucked idiot' and some of your other dumb arsed mates being locked up, then be my guest, ARSEHOLES......I'm off to the lovely land of smiles, for a snappy singh beer and whatever else good comes my way, you can bet your last dollar that my arse won't be on display in the local cell. If you think your hard done by with your stories about Thailand then WAKE UP TO YOURSELFS AND LOOK IN THE MIRROR......YOU SAD ARSED FOOLS !!!!!
.
If your feeling upset by my comments, thats because the truth hurts and if you want to square up, head up to my patch in Northern NSW and I'll introduce you to a bit of good ole policing Australian style. My bet is, none of you have the guts anyway, so chow !!!

December 13, 2006 4:07 PM

Looper says:

Some Aussie police are arseholes but you sound like one of the good guys Road Natzi. I got stopped last week for going through an orange light. I think it was petty retribution because I got there while it was still orange and he didn't. Unfortunately 200 baht won't get you off the hook with these guys.

'If your feeling upset by my comments' - I am not upset by your comments Road Natzi but I am curiously unsettled by your use of periods to demarcate your paragraphs.

December 13, 2006 6:53 PM

Pants Elk says:

Hey, Road Natzi (charming nick, btw - your own?) - why don't you and "Common Sense" form a vigilante posse and clean up the entire world? A 'filth'busting duo, whoring and fighting their way across the planet! It'd be awesome, dude! You could wear capes and everything!

December 13, 2006 7:58 PM

Road Natzi says:

Yes, Yes, Yes, Pants Elk....NOW YOUR TALKING, I would love to wear the cape thing & conquer the world, then everyone could errect statues of me around the place, a bit like Saddam.

I won't be silly get taken out by Moron like BUSH tho !!!

Anyway chaps, I was looking for a bite, but didnt really get one, so I will shope else where. I'm about to book another ticket to Thailand for early next year, but still havent allowed any extra time to visit LOW LIFE DRUGGIES in the Thailand jails.

Keep smiling and remember those two important things:-
1. Road Natzi is always right
2. If Road Natzi is ever wrong then refer back to rule 1.

Happy Hunting

ROAD NATZI

December 16, 2006 4:38 PM

ISAAN BOB says:

ROAD NATZI,

From your attitude, it is very clear to me that it's just a matter of time before you get popped for something inconsequential, and wind up in a Thai jail eating Maleng Sab off the floor (if you're fast enough to catch them, that is!). It's your know-it-all, negative, disrespectful attitude that Thais hate, that'll eventually do you in.

I'd love to see how smart-ass and sanctimonious you are after that, about how anyone in a Thai lockup deserves to be there!

Isaan Bob

December 23, 2006 1:18 AM

Road Natzi says:

Isaan Bob,

It would take a much better man than you to get me in there !!!!

Why don't you go back up north weirdo and keep sucking the puss out of ur missus ugly isaan arse, god knows ur the right man for the job.

Bob, your just another self proclaimed 'expert' on thailand. Anyone with a brain knows that an expert is only a drip under pressure....

You blokes have got no idea & I sincerely wish you all the best for your future which I have no doubt is going to be fairly bleek !!!

cya
signed
Road Kill

ps: The attitude is a put on, I just like to see worms like you wriggle...and boy don't you all dance to my tune !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

December 23, 2006 3:57 PM

john colins says:

you can get easy in jail in thailand, i went to jail because my exgirlfriend beated a whole in my head with her shoe, but she was quicker at the policestation than me,because i had to go to the hospital to get my head stitched. 5555555555555555

February 19, 2007 6:01 AM

dave says:

Thats horseshit I knew a man had a 10 year over stayed he payed a fine and did 1 year in jail.

You did some bad shit
probably no money loser.

April 5, 2007 10:00 AM

jollyboy says:

I Love the way road natzi goes "mainly due to the fact my father lived there for a long time". That has got to be the biggest excuse for a nonse I have heard in years.

April 7, 2007 4:01 AM

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